Pro Cannabis Media and Cannabis.net will be presenting a Weed Talk Live NOW, a shorter version of our monthly show, to go over cannabis topics from around the country!
Jimmy Young:
Hi everyone. Welcome to Weed Talk Now. I'm Jimmy Young from Pro Cannabis Media.
Curt Dalton:
I'm Curt Dalton from Cannabis.Net.
Jimmy Young:
See how that works. Curt and I are regulars doing a monthly live stream that we call, Weed Talk Live with Curt and Jimmy, and now we're recording it and we're going to try and do three of these every week. See Curt, I managed to date it and say exactly what we're going to be doing every week, and hopefully we'll be able to have new content out, talking about this crazy wide world do of weed that's out there. Everything's changing in cannabis now. The reason why we're doing this like this is social distancing. I think we all recognize that we are in unprecedented time in our history, all of us battling and changing our daily lifestyles in order to avoid getting the COVID-19, the Coronavirus that is wreaking havoc not just here in the United States, but all over the world.
Jimmy Young:
Curt, you as a regular content producer for Cannabis.Net, have been working this story and the impact of the COVID-19 on the Cannabis Universe over the past week, right?
Curt Dalton:
Yeah. We've been looking at a lot of different aspects, originally just starting out with, can cannabis help in fighting the virus physically or is there any type of cure or vaccine involving cannabis and then working our way down to the implications as far as State law, Federal law. Is it an essential item as some States have said, is it a medical item, and again, just kind of sprawling out how far COVID is affecting the industry all the way from funding, to deliveries, to stuff like that.
Jimmy Young:
Yeah, and amazingly, there actually may be some good news for the Cannabis Universe depending on the recovery aspects of this new program that the Congress has finally voted in. When the economy eventually returns and we eventually start to recover and actually start spending money again, there actually could be some positive effects for the cannabis industry as well.
Curt Dalton:
Yeah. We've mentioned in an article that the obvious answer is, does COVID-19 help or hurt cannabis legalization. The the knee jerk reaction or the blink reaction as well, it hurts it because anything that isn't a non essential saving life piece of legislature or for the economy is going to get push back. It doesn't matter what you are, cannabis is just going to get thrown in the truckload of 'things we'll work on later', we have a big problem.
Curt Dalton:
In that sense, it's true. As you mentioned, the Congress Spending Act did not treat cannabis favorably in the sense, it did not include any safe banking act ad-ons, it did not include cannabis based companies as part of the bailout or it being able to get a loan. I don't think unemployment will cover cannabis based registered companies, so it wasn't super friendly. The good news is, or the silver lining is people are starting to say, in a recovery, depending on if this recession is B shaped with a quick turn and we're back working and people are getting their jobs back or more of a U shape that takes longer or even a depression like state that's a really beat down economic country.
Curt Dalton:
Cannabis legalization can be something that the government does out of necessity in order to create jobs, in order to create funding, in order to create businesses. In the sense that it held up so well in the downturn, that this showed the government, that even when times are really tough, just like booze historically, cigarettes, diapers, household items do well during a recession or depression. Cannabis did very well during this, not only as a medical purpose but as a sellable good.
Curt Dalton:
So if they're looking for things and we get to a desperate state that create jobs, that's certainly something the federal government could say, "Everything's on the deck. What can we do to create 200,000 jobs within a week or what can we do?" Everything goes. Systems all go. Cannabis may be take that wave and get Legalization.
Jimmy Young:
Well, we can always hope about that but one of the other good signs about what's been going on is the Google report that the searches for how to grow, how to sell and how to ship weed are up 450% according to our friends on Google and another factoid that we can throw in there is, there are three elements of our world that are actually seeing a spike in business right now. That would be liquor, that would be weed and that would be guns. Now the third one definitely freaks me out a little bit, but the other two I can handle.
Curt Dalton:
Yeah. What we looked at was, if we hit a prolonged recession, slash, depression, what will people do to pay the bills? Generally when there's a lot of worry, people will extend themselves, take risks they maybe shouldn't or are used to. So we looked at what people are reading the news saying everybody wants medical or recreational marijuana during this downturn, how many people are investigating the idea of, "Hey, I have to make ends meet. Can I sell weed? Could I grow it? What do I have to do and how do I sell it?" Our article looked at, are you going to sell it locally? You got to grow 10 or 12 plants and kind of sell it amongst your friends to raise money or are you going to take that next step to put it in the mail, maybe get a higher return but take a much bigger risk with the federal law.
Curt Dalton:
Cannabis is a schedule one substance, cannot cross the State line, cannot be put in the post office or FedEx or UPS, federal offenses. The article looks at, yes, a lot of people are thinking, how am I going to make $500 next month or a thousand or 2000 and pay my bills, rent and food. How many of them were going to stay local and how many have aspirations to, 'I'm going to throw it in the mail and double back and seal it and see what happens.'
Jimmy Young:
Not that I've ever done this, nor have I ever thought about doing this, but just in case one would want to ship cannabis across state lines illegally, because it is a federal substance, doesn't it make more sense to kind of either hollow out a book and put it inside that or wrap it up in some socks and put it in with some other clothes and then wrap that up and then put that in an envelope and send that? Isn't that the easiest way as long as you're only sharing maybe personal use amounts?
Curt Dalton:
Yes and no. If you're looking to bundle it with a group, it's the smell, especially if you're sending flower. Not so much edibles or take to church that can be sealed or even edibles that are kind of vacuum sealed. The smell of the flower is what gives it away, it's what dogs can pick up. That's why most people will double vacuum seal it, see your vacuum sealer at Costco or somewhere else. It's not so much not seeing it in the x-ray, it's about, they can't x-ray it. Shipping is obviously going bananas right now with e-commerce. If the smell is there, it's going to be the tell and that's what people worry about with shipping.
Jimmy Young:
Yeah, well I think there's ways around that with vacuum seals and these tremendous plastic containers that are out there that are so childproof, even an adult with arthritis has issues opening it and I can attest to that. I do want to talk a little bit about the fact that there are now 250,000 people employed in the cannabis industry nationwide. There are projections to go to 1 million employed and based on the unemployment figures that exploded over the last 48 hours because of this pandemic. That's another reason why the legislature may actually say, "You know what, we got to deal with this. This is a great way for us to spur the economy and also create jobs." That's an opportunity, isn't it?
Curt Dalton:
Yeah, certainly at that point, if you're seeing 20 to 30 million Americans on unemployment or unemployment hits the high teens, early 20%, stuff we haven't seen since the Great Depression, and it's to no lose for politicians. You have voter support above 50% on the Republican side, you have massive Democratic support. They're going to put a federal sales tax on it. I know people hate to hear that. Of course, they are.
Curt Dalton:
It's a way to appease the voters, give people relief from anxiety of stress of their lives, make money, create, I don't know, let's say another 800,000 jobs and you forget too, if you're going to legalize it, you bring in that billion dollars of funding from quote, real companies and real providers that want to get into this industry to build our infrastructure, build our shipping. That would create even more jobs, accountants, buildings, construction, all the way down the line.
Curt Dalton:
So absolutely and that's, I hate to say it, if you're really looking at this as a shot for cannabis, you have to root for a long, painful recession, depression to get it done because if it's a quick V, if we're up and running here in 90 days and everyone's getting jobs back and we just all kind of wipe our brow, cannabis is going to be pushed to the back again for another three or four years.
Jimmy Young:
Yeah, well it was in the back for 80 years and now at least we are talking about it and I always pinch myself when that happens. I just cannot believe that it's 2020 and we have legal cannabis in Massachusetts, our home state, and we're talking about it as a regular item, a regular business item, and now perhaps it will impact the new economy, when we finally get back to actually having an economy again.
Jimmy Young:
Let's talk about the essentials. California immediately said that cannabis consumption and adult use recreational sales would continue, that it's an essential part of the California economy. Massachusetts governor, Charlie Baker decided to say, "No, it's not for adult use, but we will definitely make it available for our medical card holders." Speaking as one who has one, I still have access to my medical dispensary's to get my medicine, but why in the world is everything difficult in Massachusetts? Why are they always looking to make it into a necessary evil weed and always looking to give people like a Kobie Evans who just opened up the first adult use dispensary in Boston at Pure Oasis. He just wrote a letter to the governor, pleading with him to allow them to continue to have business. I just feel so bad for those people.
Curt Dalton:
Yeah, I mean Governor Baker, to answer your question, has just never been a fan of legalized cannabis. We kind of led a discussion in one of our articles and then on to LinkedIn where, is this an anti pot Baker move to say, "Medical but not rec." Well, maybe not. People aren't familiar, Massachusetts probably has 200 person lines all day long at the probably 11 or 12 rec dispensaries open. We just don't have enough open.
Curt Dalton:
I think what the governor's fearful of is the social distancing. People standing wrapped around a building, six inches apart as well as in the dispensary. The secondary thing you have to worry about is supply here in Massachusetts, because he has dragged his feet. We don't have a lot of supply and because it can't come over a state line, he wants to protect the medical users first and then the rec people can kind of get what's left maybe.
Curt Dalton:
People who don't like that answer are going to say, "Well it's his fault. He dragged his feet. He didn't get this industry up." That is also correct, but we're in the point of a deadly virus that is killing people. That's a discussion for another day and yes, he should own that. If he had a hundred rec dispensary's open, we might not be at this price, but right now we can't get into that 'well you did this. You should correct it by opening rec dispensary's with 200 person lines all day." You just can't do that with a virus.
Jimmy Young:
I get that, but why not allow the people who do want it for adult use and recreational purposes to make appointments to pick up their orders at a specific time. People are pretty good about doing things like that now, they're adapting how they get their groceries, they're adapting when they get their groceries. The same thing can be said for adult use cannabis. To me they could make a unilateral decision and say, "Okay, we're shutting down the adult use recreation." Isn't it against the law in Massachusetts? This is one of the things that I love about lawyers. They wrote this law, it's out there and already the governor is saying, "Well maybe not in this a public emergency." We're going to change the law to fit his needs. It's Baker's needs. It's not the people who want..
Jimmy Young:
People want this thing. They voted it in four years ago. Again, you finally took four years for them to get a Boston dispensary open and now you say, "Okay, you can't be open anymore." I don't understand why a compromise wasn't made. I think Kobie Evan's letter that he wrote that is now posted on LinkedIn, the owner of Pure Oasis, cuts right to the chase. He says, "Look, we'll social distance, we'll make this available for delivery only. We'll make this available for pickup only." There are so many different ways, pizza shops are adapting to this. Why the hell can't adult use recreational dispensaries and let the government let them do it. It pisses me off, Curt.
Curt Dalton:
If they could, you can make it say, look, no one can be inside of an adult rec dispensary. Everything must be ordered online or delivered. So now you're looking at Leafly Pickup and Weedmaps pickup, which is integrated with MJ Freeway so they could do it. Then it becomes a supply issue, right. Is there enough to meet the supply of rec. Let's say if 67 or 57 all total dispensaries were given a waiver and yet you hit on it. State of emergency, Governor Baker also closed every coffee shop, restaurant and non essential business. I don't know if that's legal, but if you own a franchise or you rely on people coming in and they can't come in anymore, you're in dire straights. So we'll have to see how that plays out. I just wonder at that point, if they had gone to call it the head like the curbside delivery basically.
Jimmy Young:
Right.
Curt Dalton:
If there's enough parking and enough supply in Massachusetts to keep the medical people from running out.
Jimmy Young:
I ordered an Anthony's pizza and they brought it out to my car with gloves on and all that. I didn't see a mask, but I did see gloves and that was fine by me. What effect is this whole new world of how we're dealing with this going to effect the illicit market? I don't like to call it by that taller name, but the illicit market, the market that is still thriving in an adult legal state.
Curt Dalton:
Well obviously just the basic economics of when you cut off the rec supply that's been tested and the legal supply, demand is still there. They're going to go get their moonshine, as they would say back in prohibition. So yes, the black market is going to get a huge boost from this because you're asking people who enjoy it recreationally or need it for stress and anxiety, but don't have a medical card per se. Maybe they don't want it for work reasons or health records, to basically go to the black market and go get your stuff.
Curt Dalton:
I would assume black markets in Massachusetts, Maine, New Hampshire, Connecticut and upstate New York are booming with Massachusetts people making a phone call, getting on a WhatsApp or a telegram and finding a black market or elicit supplier.
Jimmy Young:
They've been doing that for decades, okay.
Curt Dalton:
Yeah.
Jimmy Young:
Meeting in parking lots and what have you. These laws are designed to perhaps hurt that market and with the hopeful effect of actually eliminating the illicit market, because I definitely want to know where this product came from, I want it to be tested, I want to know what kind of an effect it's going to have on me if I use it. So again, it's a whole new world, man. This is going to change. It continues to change almost on a daily basis, which is one of the reasons why I really like the idea that we will be talking almost on a daily basis, to continue to look at the issues and the news that are out there in cannabis, not just here in Massachusetts but across the entire country.
Jimmy Young:
I got to tell you something, Curt, I don't know who did the graphic with the little cannabis leaf on the football helmet in one of your articles. This was brilliant. I'd like to see a team eventually have that as their regular emblem. I'm not quite sure how we get that through, but yeah, it would be funny, wouldn't it?
Curt Dalton:
The Emerald Triangle 'OGee Cushions, here they come, come on out.
Jimmy Young:
That's it, and Lord knows the XFL would do anything just to get ratings.
Curt Dalton:
Oh, totally. Yeah.
Jimmy Young:
You do remember the XFL. It did exist for about what, three or four weeks?
Curt Dalton:
And they do have, I think four or five players getting ready to be signed or drafted for the NFL here in the draft. So good for them.
Jimmy Young:
That's another thing Curt and I do have in common, is that we are both sports fans and I got to tell you, we're also Celtics fans specifically. I am definitely going through withdrawal, but I will tell you that I know for a fact that our local NBC Sports Boston channel will be airing game six of the 2008 NBA finals between the Boston Celtics and the LA Lakers at The Garden that night, and that is by far the greatest sporting event that I've ever attended live, because it was my team winning the game, winning the championship on their home court. It was a tremendous celebration and we had a lot of fun and I will never forget that memory and I hope to relive it through the instant replay world and file tape as we used to say. I'm looking forward to that. You know that's on tonight at eight o'clock?
Curt Dalton:
Yeah, if you remember too, I was at that game as well. That was a route, I think the Celtics were up by like 30 in the second and maybe kept it at 30 in the third quarter.
Jimmy Young:
Yep.
Curt Dalton:
It was kind of a foregone conclusion the last 20 minutes of the game, that the Celtics were going to win the title at home that night. Funny story that, I ended up sitting a row behind Matt Castle and Wes Welker, where I was sitting. One of the funniest stories was a guy goes, "Hey", he looked at Matt Castle and goes, "You're the guy from the Patriots?" The guy goes, "Yeah", he kind of like, okay. He goes, "Not the top [inaudible 00:18:35], but as back up." He didn't know his name. It was great.
Jimmy Young:
Hey, they used to say-
Curt Dalton:
Matt Castle took it well too, he got a big contract a year or two later, so he did all right.
Jimmy Young:
Right. I think the best job in the NFL is the backup quarterback anyway, right? I mean, that's what they say, carrying around a clipboard all the time. Hey, one more comment about some of the things that you posted on Cannabis.Net and by the way, Curt is a content producing machine. Go to Cannabis.Net and you'll see a ton of information there. You can spend hours on his site and most people spend over 23 minutes on his site right, Curt. After all, you are a number one as far as, time on site in the Cannabis Universe. You must be very proud of that?
Curt Dalton:
Yeah, we kind of create a different kind of rabbit hole, I guess you want to call it. If you're going down on a website where we do more opinionated pieces and we'll give it some thought, not just reprinting a press release or saying, here's the news, the DEA did this. Let's say like yesterday the DEA admitted that legal cannabis reduces drug cartel power in money. We said, well why did they admit that now?
Curt Dalton:
So you kind of start clicking and at the bottom of every article is two related articles, so if you want to find out about fibromyalgia or you're interested in how COVID-19, I think we have like six articles out dealing with COVID-19 and cannabis right now. There's a new angle and a new thing to talk about seems like every day or so. So you kind of get into this, well that's interesting, could you ship it across the State line during this virus? Oh, does THC help in fighting this virus and you just kind of end up reading seven or eight articles just like a book.
Jimmy Young:
Well Curt, I think technically we figured out how to do this. I look forward to chatting with you on a somewhat regular basis moving forward. We definitely want to give a shameless plug here to our next live chit chat. We Talk Live with Curt and Jimmy on Thursday, April 16th. We have a very special guest scheduled for that. He's the CEO of Curaleaf, his name is Joe Lusardi and you know Curt, I've been after him to come in studio since September because they're located in Massachusetts and Curaleaf is a big multi-state operator. Needless to say, their recreational operation in Provincetown got shut down as well. So everyone has something to say about it, and I know you're looking forward to having Joe, if not in studio, we'll be talking to him perhaps even like this.
Curt Dalton:
Yeah, Joe's a great guy and they just had some good earnings even with kind of not counting what's been happening in the last few weeks. I'm sure he'll have a lot to say and both you and I were out in one of his places in Nevada a few months ago and got to see him there. It'll be great to catch up and see what Curaleaf's doing during this pandemic.
Jimmy Young:
Right and difficult time. We appreciate you tuning in and checking us out. We will have more of, Weed Talk Now with Curt and Jimmy. So for now, for Curt Dalton, I'm Jimmy Young from Pro Cannabis Media. Remember, it's a whole new world of weed out there, and we'll talk to you again on, Weed Talk Now.
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