The first piece Cannabis.Net did with Dale can be found here. If you are unfamiliar with his story, please read this piece on Dale and his journey first and then listen or read our interview. The first piece is titled. "Parents Prepare To Break The Law To Help Their Children".
You can listen to the latest interview with Dale where he tells us what the latest updates on his Colin are, how the autism strains are coming, and where he is at legally in the state of Georgia by clicking on the YouTube video below.
Hey Dale. Can you hear me?
I can hear you.
Excellent. Excellent. I can hear you just fine. And I just wanted to say thanks for coming on tonight with us, and I hope it wasn't... We're doing a late night edition, but I just had the lightning and thunder starting here, but I think we can get through it.
Alright. I was gonna do... Just introduce you now to the people that are listening and might not be familiar to your story. We're talking to Dale Jackson from cannabis.net as we reach out to Dale. And for the background some of the people may not know that we had done a story about you on the... A few months ago actually, about the story. I'll let you talk about your son a little bit. And someone sent you the story and it's been passed around now to where it has, I think 6,000 likes or comments and maybe 1,200 shares, something like that. So why don't you tell us a little bit about what you're doing with cannabis oil and your son, and tell the people that aren't familiar with your story, say how you first came about with this type of research.
Okay, well one... There you are. Thanks for allowing me to come and share my story about my son. It actually all started with my best friend and his daughter who had severe seizure disorder. And so I've always been... Well, I say always, for probably the past five or six years, been heavily involved in politics here in Georgia. And so I just knew a lot of the state house members and I'm chairman over the third congressional district here for the Republican party. And so I knew that there was this movement of medical cannabis, and had absolutely no idea what it was, and had no idea if it could help my friend. But his daughter was literally within weeks facing major brain surgery to try to control her seizures.
And so we were just meeting one evening, sharing a glass of Bourbon and a cigar. And I said, "Hey, before you actually follow through with having a piece of her brain removed and then going through months and months of potential therapy just to teach her how to walk and talk again, you oughta at least look into this." And I believe within three weeks they were actually living in Colorado and had her... It's not an exact science. You have to start somewhere and you tweak things as you go, but they had her on cannabis oil and within a few weeks she had her first seizure free week in years.
And so, of course his wife and her moved out to Colorado, he stayed here in LaGrange. Obviously he had a business, he had to run the business. And so, he started out at the capital and at that point, because I was generally already at the capital anyway, I just started to learn more and more about it. And then the more I learned about it the more I learned that it potentially could help my own son.
And my son is severely autistic, for anyone that doesn't know that. He just turned eight this past March. He has never spoken a word, he is what they would refer to as 'very low-functioning' autistic. We are blessed in that he does not demonstrate any severe self-harm behaviors. If, anybody that's out there listening or that watches this, if you've ever witnessed that, that's life changing. To see a human being that is so frustrated with whatever they're hearing, whatever they're feeling within their body and they're unable to communicate that, that's a level of frustration that no human being should have to go through. And to them, for whatever reason, the answer is to hurt themselves or to hurt others.
So thankfully my son does not demonstrate any of those behaviors, but as an autistic dad, that's one of the fears that we go to sleep every single night. Because generally there's no warning with autistic children. And as an example, every night my son would typically rock himself to sleep in his bed. And he'll tap his head on the wall 'cause his bed is right up against the wall. And we have to deal with that fear that one morning we're gonna wake up, and it's only gonna be that little tap, but it could literally be him banging his head against the wall.
So that's part of the realization that we come to, and that I'm not willing to just sit back and say, "Well, cannabis oil may be for those extreme cases and my son doesn't suffer with that, so I'm not gonna worry about that." As a father, I have to worry about that now and try to get the legal groundwork done, the research done, so that one day I may wake up to that reality, and I need to be prepared for that.
So, walk the listeners and the readers through, what has happened from the first time you tried the oil 'til now, 'til present day? What has your son gone through or what's it been like?
Well, I can obviously tell you my story. There's also the story of the countless other autistic children that, as I mention, that do have issues like the self injury behaviour. The story with those children is literally night and day. It's the story between the four-year-old little girl that was having to be strapped to her bed for six to eight hours a day, because she was literally biting her arm and ripping her skin off. To where now she is going to school, and a happy, joyful, little girl that still does have tendencies that you have to work through. But, another young 14-year-old autistic [07:08] ____, that literally has not been able to go out to eat with their parents or go the store. Just last week we got a message that for the first time in years, that his mom, all by herself, was able to take him out to dinner with the rest of the family. Took him to the store [07:28] ____.
As far as my son, the [07:33] ____ ratio that we have developed for Colin is a little bit higher in CBD, but also a significant level of THC as well. Both have healing properties. With Colin, and children like Colin, that don't have those extreme behaviors, we're trying to focus more on cognitive development. So, with them, you're not going to see so much as a night and day difference. One day on the oil then what happens the next day? With my son, what we're able to see, and the changes that we have seen since, I believe it was March 3rd is when we officially started the oil with him, is that his body is able to relax. He loves the water, but he's always extremely tense. And so when we give him a bath, he loves getting a bath but he would always just sit up in the water and just play with the water, splashing. He loves to see the water splashing. And that was one of the very first most dramatic things, because for the first time ever, just a couple days after the marijuana oil we just gave him a bath, and we turned around, we didn't know where he went 'cause we were sitting down on the bathroom floor as he plays, and all sudden his head disappear.
So as a parent we jump up. And for the first time ever he is laying, sprawled out in our big garden tub and he's just laying and he was relaxed. We've never seen him do that. I've tried to get him to do that. I try to lay him back, and the second I lay him back his whole body just tenses up. And then the second I take my hands off of him, he sits back up.
Another thing is his ability, we feel like, to learn, to understand. Obviously we still have that language barrier and he cannot communicate with us. But we feel like we're beginning to see a breakthrough, where in some areas he is understanding us, and that's extremely important. One example of that, on a semi regular basis when it gets around supper time, I can walk into the living room and tell him, "Hey Colin, it's time to eat supper, go to your chair at the dinner table." And he will get up and walk to his chair in the kitchen. Or later on in the evening I can tell him, "Hey Colin, it's time to go to bed." And it's not a perfect communication or an understanding, but he understands things to a degree. And that's a level of communication that we've never had before. I know that maybe seems extremely small, but as a parent that has never been able to communicate with their child anyway, that's a huge breakthrough.
Wow. You had mentioned when we were talking off the camera about strains you're developing for autism, and what you're learning about different strains. Can you give us a little insight on how that's going, or what you found in your autistic study with different strains of cannabis or marijuana?
Well, I can certainly go into some degree vague description. We have to be careful to what level of detail we go into. But the main thing that my focus is... I'm obviously passionate about autism. And the science that is going into all of the different cannabis, there are wonderful companies out there that have invested a lot of money into this technology. It all started, at least in my world, with control NCU's. 'Haley's Hope', out in Colorado, practically saved my best friend's daughter's wife. There's no telling what her quality of life would be today if it weren't for 'Haley's Hope'.
But that doesn't mean that all cannabis oil is good for everybody. And so that's where my passion has led me is, some children with Autism can benefit greatly from oils that are technically hemp oil, even if they do come [12:27] ____ from cannabis plant, like 'Haley's Hope', or 'Charlotte's Web' or whatever. But the majority of Autistic children need something with a significantly higher level of THC.
We've also seen great strides, if you recall the little girl that I mentioned that had to to be strapped to the bed. For her, it's THCA. She actually responds much better to a much higher level of THCA, but also a significant level of THC as well. We're also working on another strain that is a one to one, CBD to THC. And then 'Colin's Voice', named after my son, there again has a much higher level of... It's a three to one CBD to THC.
And I'm sure we'll have parents of Autistic children listening and reading this. If they wanted to try this treatment, what would they do tomorrow? What would they have to do to get these oils?
Well, that's a very important and extremely complicated process. So in order to properly explain what I'm about to explain, we have to go back two years and talk about what happened here in Georgia. As we started the battle the very first year here in Georgia, very complicated, nothing passed. So then we came back the second year, and our goal was to get some type of a cannabis oil law passed. And we were successful in getting something passed. And what that was in layman's terms is if you have a list of X, Y and Z condition and you live here in Georgia, then you can go to a doctor and you have to get your doctor to write off, just he can sign his name and say, "Hey, I think cannabis oil may help this purpose." It's not a prescription. It's just a doctor saying, "Your condition is one of these eight that's listed, and I think it maybe will help you." Then you take that in, and you have to register with the state, just like it is in, I'm sure, in nearly every state. You get your medical card or red card, whatever. And here in Georgia, that's all you get. And that doesn't necessarily give you any right to purchase anything because we have no cultivation program here in Georgia. And we all know, if you don't grow it in your state, then there's very, very, very few avenues that you can take to legally purchase it.
So, with that being said, we came back the next year and we were trying to pass a cultivation bill, plus expand the conditions that are covered legally to get a card. The first thing that got cut off of our legislation was the cultivation. We got a [15:41] ____, never gonna happen under my watch, certainly not this year. So then we said, "Well, at this point, let's move for and at least get a couple of conditions added." Our primary focus was Autism because Autism's not covered under the original bill that passed.
So we came down to the wire in the very last day of session, and went, myself and a couple of other close family friends, went and met with the lieutenant governor, he was gonna try to help us out. And they brought a bill to us that said, "Hey, we're gonna include Autism, but we're going to reduce the legal percentage of THC that we're gonna allow you to have in the oil." And so, first and foremost we have families that had moved back to Georgia from Colorado because they could get that particular level of THC, and they were gonna have to move back to Colorado. Plus the main focus was Autism, which was great, but if you lower the percentage of THC, well now there's a very significant percentage of Autism patients that need that higher level of THC in their oils. So it was just a big game that they were playing with us. So we said, "No," we said, "Vote it down. We're done. We're not accepting anything." Because we knew whenever we get another bill, they're gonna be very hesitant to want to come back the next year and address this issue again.
So, that leads us to where we are today. Where we are is the governor has given a list of families that said, "Hey, I'm not gonna let you buy it, but if you can go break the law in some other state, and then break federal law to bring it back here then I'm fine with it." Said, "Well, that legally doesn't help us, but, hey, if that's what you want us to do, then we're gonna take you up on your offer." The problem with that, and here's where it's so difficult to communicate the urgency to other people. People in families that don't deal with this on a daily basis. I mean just imagine yourself, anybody, John Doe, goes out to Colorado. Well, who do you know in Colorado that you could buy [18:20] ____ from? Before it was a very hard job trying to find anybody. So what you're left with is, okay, what can you do in Colorado legally? You can buy weed, recreational grade weed and then you can process it in your hotel room and then you can smuggle it back here, that's one thing. Where do you go to get tested? Because you have to know, what is this that I'm dealing with? Just because it's oil, just 'cause it's concentrate, that doesn't mean that it's the particular strain and ratio that your child may need.
I always tend to take things a little bit further. So I said "Well, I got a group of... " I didn't, but we as families just came together and then we said "Well, why don't we do all the homework? Why don't do all the leg work? Let's go find somebody. We know what type of oil that we need, and let's just go get someone else to put it together for us." And then all we're doing is we're serving basically as a go-between. Families come to us and most of them are families that we know but there may or... Whoever comes to us that explains what their situation is. And we have a lot of expertise at our disposal. Doctors, physicians, pharmacists, that help us and that we act as a [20:05] ____ to help that parent that they have an autistic child or they have an Uncle that has Parkinson's. And this is just things I've had conversations today; with cancer, leukemia, Parkinson's, dementia, ALS, and that's just today.
And so what we do is we have a medical form that we ask them to fill out just so we can get some data and we understand what medications they're taking right now. And then we serve as that, basically a counselor and say, "Okay well, after talking with this doctor and this particular pharmacist because you're already taking this medication, we don't want this to interact with it. Then we would suggest that you go and contact somebody in California to get this particular strain. We feel like that would help you."
It's amazing that there are so many avenues out there for people that are needing or wanting to know more. But there's very few avenues out there where a parent really feels like that they have a team helping them. You can go and order things the dispensary's out in California or Oregon or Washington. But how often do you get to sit down with other parents that are going through the same thing that you're going through? And that one-on-one interaction where; one, they know exactly what you're going through. And two to say that they have enough experience and expertise in the field to actually help you know exactly what you're looking in.
We all know, ask for the labs, you gotta see a lab report. How many parents out there do you think really know and understand what a lab report means? But you can sit down with two other parents and a pharmacist, or whoever and get some counselling on that. And then you can really feel like you're not alone anymore. And as so many special needs parents, we battle our whole life. We feel like we're battling the system no matter what, whether it's in school with other children or the government with our care or even our doctor sometimes. And we feel like that a lot of families and parents appreciate where they feel like they're a part of the team and not having a battle to care for their children, or themselves.
Let me put you on the spot. It's November. Dale Jackson is voted president of the United States. What is Dale Jackson's Cannabis Marijuana policy? President Jackson, go ahead. Federal. Federal level. You have the man calling you.
Federal level? I would legalize Cannabis oil for any and everybody. At the bare minimum, there are no negative side effects to Cannabis oil. I almost feel like that's a trick question 'cause it's so simple but maybe it's not.
No, I mean on the whole...
As far as legalizing it?
I'm curious on your whole entire marijuana cannabis... Is it legal recreational and medical federally? Say, over 21, treat it like alcohol? Are there more restrictions on it if you're the president? What does the new president, if that's you, say for the country's policy on not just the oil but the flower as well?
That is a battle in and of itself, and my personal opinions on that are not significant when it comes to Cannabis oil. Right now, here in Georgia, we are fighting tooth and nail for Canibus oil and access to it. At the bare minimum, I'm a limited government believer, I believe in the free market and I believe in limited government. Extreme limited government. So I believe in the state's rights, so more power to Washington and Colorado and whatever they want to do, that's their deal, they can do it. That's all I'm sayin'.
Great political answer there. It's not your first rodeo I see. What's your greatest fear? Not regarding your son's health, but you've been very vocal in breaking the law, and helping people do that. Do you have any fears just from this moment going forward? Are they washed away now that you're out there? Or do you fear waking up one day and being made an example of? Or going to jail?
Yeah, I don't really fear that for myself. I mean ultimately that would be a... My wife would really not like this answer.
But I'm just saying that ultimately it would be a good thing for the movement for them to come in and arrest me and put me before a jury, and they're gonna lose. And we've had conversations with our DA and our Sheriff, and everybody else at every level in the state of Georgia, and they know that. They don't want to arrest any of us because they know that we'll win before a jury. The only reason why I fear that is simply for my wife. And we have three children and it's tough enough that I have to spend as much time as I do away from home just in everything that I'm involved in. And that would be devastating to her, and for her to have to go through. So I fear that, I don't think it's going to happen. Ultimately I don't want it to happen. Because at that point then, the level of care, and the amount of people that we're able to facilitate getting help, what happens to them?
The ultimate reason why that I don't think that's going to happen, is because if you take a step back and look at this from a 50,000 square foot [26:48] ____, We're actually doing the governor a favor. See, the governor can deny everybody legal access, but if he has somebody like us that is just simply acting as a go-between to help people make sure they have oil. Well then now he can claim, "Well we don't need a cultivation program. We got parents out there helping other parents get, actually get, the oil." So in one regard, that's hurting us legislatively. But at the same time, because we've already done all the legwork and the homework and worked with other people in other states to come up with these ratios and strains, people are getting helped. And ultimately at the end of the day, that's what it's all about.
And for every one person that we can help, then they all have family members. We know how this works. When a person that is maybe against just cannabis in general, has a dad, mother, or a sister, or a bother, that is able to help with either cannabis oil, or whatever means, and all the sudden that person's opinion is forever changed on this whole issue. And that's what we're able to do. It's just one aspect of the big picture legislative process of trying to get legal access here in Georgia.
That's a great transition to this question; If we have people from around the world that read and listen to our videos and interviews. If I'm in Australia, Canada, France, Denmark, Nigeria, and I'm hearing this story and watching this video, and they can't get to you, they can't get to Georgia, you have a blue print on how you started. What would you tell them, listening in their bedroom, with an autistic child who they'd like to help, that they have no access to where you are. How do you start?
What you just described, that's the... (emotional pause)
Because I bet there's a lot of Dale Jackson dads that would like to know, "What do I do tomorrow morning after I go drop the kids off?", or "What I do to become you? What do I do to start to help my child?"
That's a conversation that I have everyday. I've got friends in Great Britain and Australia and India, and I know their family, I know their situation. That's probably one of the most painful conversations that I have to have. Because they are reaching out, and I can't help them. That's a line that we... We can't cross that line. And on top of that is, I don't really have a reference to draw from. I don't know what a dispensary looks like in these other countries. It's very difficult and we certainly tried to give them advice.
But your question is, how do you start? Gosh. One thing is that I would have to make the assumption that in every single country out there, there are Facebook groups, secret Facebook cannabis groups, that are helping families. And I didn't learn about those groups till I was deep into this whole process. And so, start asking vague questions on Facebook. You're not doing anything illegal. No one's gonna come at you and arrest you just because you're asking questions. You're asking, "Hey, does anybody out there know anything about cannabis oil?" You would be surprised that the number of people that may contact you they say, "Hey, yeah. I know this guy," or, "I'm a member of this group," and then you start from there. There again, obviously I'm very passionate about autism. Treating autism with cannabis oil is certainly new. The whole phenomenon of autism has been going on for years but it just seems like over the last 10 to 15 years, it has dramatically increased.
Whereas, people have always heard the rumors about treating cancer with cannabis, 'Rick Simpson Oil' and stuff like that. But autism is different. A lot of autistic professionals out there, therapists, they don't know. Doctors that don't have a clue. But we are here to answer questions. We can consult. I had a person today literally took a picture of the bottle and tried to get the percentage of the THC and the THCA. And we tried our best to help them but obviously that's difficult because I can't, I don't know what labs look like from Indonesia. So, it is difficult. But just start the process and start asking questions.
Start asking questions. That's a great advice to take it to Facebook and the secretive groups that exist. So, ask questions in social media and in public places to get answers. So I guess I don't wanna take up your entire night, but I'm curious, and you must have a gut feeling on this; In seven years, let's say the next President allows full research, there's hundreds of millions of dollars, what are we gonna find out about these oils say, seven years from now that you know or you think that's gonna happen?
I think the biggest advancement is going to come as we... The more and more study that we do is gonna come with the entourage effect, of when you, when we learned... We're just now learning about the terpenes that are found in the oil. To some degree, we do a little bit of stripping as far as we wanna inject this ratio with more CBD or more THCA or more CBG or CBN. But at the same time, we really believe there is that entourage effect that we haven't been able to really pinpoint, where you have certain terpenes and how they all mix together. I think the science of that, the science of understanding how each individual cannabinoid interacts with each individual terpene and each individual receptor in our body and where we can pinpoint that. I think it's gonna be an amazing adventure as we move forward with this science and where it actually comes even more so as science than what it already is. And you got States like Washington and Colorado and Oregon that really leading the way.
But just imagine when you have all of the brain power of the United States behind this and moving forward. And frankly if we can just keep it out of the pharmaceutical giants, I'm a free marketeer, so I don't like monopolies, and I don't like when government gets involved in, well frankly, anything, but especially this.
And, so my next adventure as a duly elected delegate to the national convention is, I'm already working with Trump's campaign to try to get this particular issue on the Republican National platform. And that would be extremely instrumental into not only spreading the message, but giving legislative branches in all the States a little bit of leeway. Cause frankly, let's be honest, Republicans are a little bit scared to touch the issue.
Agree, I would agree.
If our President or nominee, whether or not he's elected president or not, but if our nominee can lead the way, we don't know liking or hating, Trump's not afraid to say anything, obviously, and so nothing scares him. And so I'm hoping that I can work this campaign to get that on the platform, and that'll help us tremendously down the road.
That's fantastic news actually. Yeah especially from the Republican side where you said it certainly seems to be like no one wants to talk about it, and when it is acknowledged it's just said that, I think he said, "Well, I have friends that have medical cards and it really works for them." That's pretty much [chuckle] all he's come out. So what is the correct way and the proper way you would like if someone hears this interview or reads about you, and they needed to send you a message? What is the proper way for Dale Jet to communicate with you online if someone wanted to get in touch with you or leave you a message?
I know this is gonna sound really bad, but my phone number is all over social media, websites. Please don't call me. I don't have that much time to talk to everybody. All you have to do is, everybody can find my Facebook page and just send me a private message on my Facebook. On my personal account just because they're easier to find. And yes Facebook is probably gonna put you in my general. I check it every hour. I will find you. I will connect you with our team, and we will start the process of doing our best to help you find access to oil wherever that may be.
Excellent. I appreciate it. Thank you, Dale. And to remind the listeners, we are doing a Late Night East Coast Edition, so we're both at our little if not so business-like. But I appreciate your time and anyway we can support you at cannabis.net, we always would do whatever you need and whatever you need from us, let us know.
Alright well thank you very much. It's been a pleasure.
Okay, thank you.
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If you are interested in cannabis oil and how TCH and CBD are being used to treat cancer, you can check out our interview with Rick Simpson, of "Rick Simpson Oil" by click here. The story is titled "Curing Cancer With Cannabis THC, Not CBD Says Rick Simpson.